MESSAGE BOARDS TOOLS:  Search | Members | User Control Panel |   | Login 


All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]

Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 11:05 pm 
User avatar
Offline
Franchise Player

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:46 pm
Posts: 3857
MarkJohnson>You wrote:
Metsfan980 wrote:
TomInNC wrote:
Won't many of them now be working for independent teams?


A lot of low level MiLB teams are owned by groups that also own independent teams as well.

So I think you're on to something.

Still, this is not good for a lot of communities where MiLB is their only professional sport.


Well, per the BA piece, there are alternatives they are looking at in these communities outside of affiliated ball (independent leagues, "Dream League" for undrafted players, expanded summer college wood bat leagues outside of just the Cape Cod league that runs now). Given most of the cut list was short season teams (I know thats not all of the teams), I think the concern of "no show in town" is abated somewhat. And especially for, like, NY Penn teams or Appy league teams - the likelihood of having real connections to the MLB affiliates is low, and the quality of players is unlikely to have a major correlation on anything given that most of those teams are filled with org fillers.


I don't know about those assumptions.

I worked in the NY-Penn league, and the team I worked for had okay attendance for most games, but was sold out in advance when the Cyclones and SI Yankees came to town. There was definitely an interest in coming out to see potential future Mets/Yankees, and especially when there was a rehabbing MLB player.

You also have to remember that those teams get to display high round draft picks that generate a local buzz. We sold Longoria jerseys for years and people came out to see him play in his brief stint there.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:21 am 
User avatar
Offline
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:11 am
Posts: 30791
Location: NYC
underdog wrote:
TomInNC wrote:
Still until I see otherwise, I'm not sure how many of these teams will simply fold with no other baseball filling the park they have. Are people in those small communities supporting these teams because they're somehow, in a tiny way, affiliaed with MLB? Is that really the deal breaker? Will they stop going if the local team is an independent filled with guys who almost certainly won't make the majors as opposed to an affiliated low A or short season team of guys almost certainly not to make the majors?



I think most will end up folding. Probably make it a couple of years but interest will wane and they will close their doors. I do think being affiliated with a MLB team helps attendance. Gives fans a chance to see possible big league players when they are just breaking in. With that no longer an option the interest will not be there.


Yeah there were always a couple of players I went to see any time I would go to a Cyclones or other A level game. But the point I was making is that minor league baseball is all that many people have access to because maybe they live in Binghamton or Tennessee or Arkansas etc. And there is a much bigger connection to be gained from the live experience than from watching on a screen. And as I said, affiliated teams will always have more marketing leverage than unaffiliated teams. So again not a very bright strategy for long term grass roots growth of the game to pull it from so many communities.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:22 am 
User avatar
Offline
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:11 am
Posts: 30791
Location: NYC
MarkJohnson>You wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
While the economic impact is real and don’t take the following as dismissing it but to me the issue with this has been about re-energizing interest and growth in the game. I mean, the big picture has shown that attendance and interest in the game in general has been down over the past 10 years and more dramatically in younger people. Yeah I know there are lots of other activities that compete for the time of kids today but that’s kind of a lame excuse. As a major sport, baseball has by and large no competition for most of the summer months.

Point is that affiliated minor leagues was an entry point to a lot of people and a way of gaining grass roots support for baseball in many parts of the country, particularly for those who don’t live in or near major cities. So to me this action is simply penny wise and pound foolish... it will directly impair any broader attempt at growing interest in the game, which I think is desperately needed. Furthermore the idea that MLB couldn’t afford to pay minor leaguers more or invest in minor league facilities is ridiculous. As is the idea that *now* we will see minor leaguers finally get paid.

As to some of these teams becoming unaffiliated, I’ve lived in the NY area all my life and just learned recently that there is an unaffiliated team that plays in Rockland County the past 10 years I think. Losing mlb affiliation is kind of a big deal iow.


I think regionality (thats not a word, but hopefully the point comes across) of affiliates to their MLB parent - or lack thereof in many cases - kills the supposed connection in a lot of cases. I don't think its any accident that the BK Cyclones do pretty well (and certainly a lot better than, say, the K-Mets). Part of this whole thing is supposed to be redoing leagues and affiliates to make more sense regionally (and of course with the added bonus of reducing travel expenses).

I'm just not sure the KMets get a boost from being affiliated with the Mets. And certainly I think you would see better interest in AA/AAA teams if they were more closely aligned with a team's natural fanbase boundaries.

There's a NY Penn team in Auburn, NY that is an affiliate of the Nationals. We vacation up in the finger lakes and have gone to a handful of their games. Thats probably a team that is going to be contracted/removed from major league affiliation. I don't think it would affect the interest in their games, which was 0% about the MLB affiliates and specific players and more about going to a wacky cheap baseball experience, much in the same way we've gone to Ducks games occassionally over the years. of course thats anecdotal, but I highly doubt a lot of the Finger Lakes region cares whether the Doubledays retain their (very loose) connection to the Nationals.

I wasn’t arguing for connection to specific ML league teams thru the live experience of minor league games but just developing what often becomes a lifetime connection to baseball as a sport. Removing that from 40+ communities is just not a strategy to grow the game.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:46 am 
Offline
Practically A Wilpon

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:45 pm
Posts: 9291
I don't think the Cyclones would be a folded team. They'd still be Mets affiliated.

It's the Kingsport type teams that would be unaffiliated. Their top couple of prospects would go to Brooklyn or St. Lucie depending on how they align their levels.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:21 am 
User avatar
Offline
Franchise Player

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:46 pm
Posts: 3857
TomInNC wrote:
I don't think the Cyclones would be a folded team. They'd still be Mets affiliated.

It's the Kingsport type teams that would be unaffiliated. Their top couple of prospects would go to Brooklyn or St. Lucie depending on how they align their levels.


It seems like the proposal would be converting the St. Lucie Mets to a short season A-ball team and converting Brooklyn to being full-season A-ball.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:09 pm 
User avatar
Offline
Everyday Player

Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 5:24 pm
Posts: 1315
I went back an read a Baseball America article, from November, about the contraction. Binghamton was/is one of the teams on the list to be contracted.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 3:39 pm 
User avatar
Offline
Veteran Presence

Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:31 am
Posts: 4502
Location: Fairview Township, PA
underdog wrote:
I went back an read a Baseball America article, from November, about the contraction. Binghamton was/is one of the teams on the list to be contracted.

Yeah, I thought it was going to be

AAA: Syracuse
AA: Brooklyn
A+: St. Lucie
A: Columbia
Short-season: GCL Mets


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 5:43 pm 
User avatar
Online
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:56 pm
Posts: 63674
underdog wrote:
I went back an read a Baseball America article, from November, about the contraction. Binghamton was/is one of the teams on the list to be contracted.


I thought they were "saved". I know Schumer took it up.

I'm pretty sure there's not going to be a separate "Florida State" and "Gulf Coast" league under the proposal, at least that was my read. The idea is to consolidate 4 full season affiliates to be near the parent and just run rookie leagues out of the ST complexes.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:54 pm 
Offline
Practically A Wilpon

Joined: Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:45 pm
Posts: 9291
That makes more sense


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:45 am 
User avatar
Offline
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:11 am
Posts: 30791
Location: NYC
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-sting-o ... or-matter/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 1:42 pm 
User avatar
Online
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:56 pm
Posts: 63674
HeyNowHK wrote:
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-sting-of-contraction-is-no-minor-matter/


A lot of this is somewhat circumstantial though - the author discusses his affinity for the local minor league teams he grew up around (which were upper level affiliates) and names prominent players who came through, noting the distinction between that and the independent league teams full of nobodies.

The KMets, over the last DECADE, have had the following major leaguers come through:

-Luis Guillorme
-Kevin Kaczmarski
-Merandy Gonzalez
-Jeff McNeil
-Amed Rosario
-Ty Bashlor
-Chris Flexen
-Corey Oswalt
-Gavin Cecchini
-Tomas Nido
-John Gant
-Robert Gsellman
-Akeel Morris
-Steven Matz (for 6 starts)
-Philip Evans
-TJ Rivera
-Chase Bradford
-Seth Lugo
-Hansel Robles
-Gabby Ynoa
-Josh Edgin
-Gonzalez Germen
-Adam Kolarek (5 appearances)
-Jacob DeGrom (6 bad starts lol)

Basically if you missed the 2013 season (where McNeil and Rosario played there together), of weren't there in 2011 for a Lugo or Robles start, you missed any players of any note passing through. Most of the Kmet rosters resemble an independent league team.

I get there will be worse examples involved, but for the most part, the Appalachian and Pioneer Leagues are not where teams send top prospects anyway. Top HS draftees are usually handled with kid gloves so those first seasons of "rookie" ball, if anything, are quite abbreviated.

If we're talking about kids getting interested in the game by following the "prospects' they once watched, we're talking more in full season ball anyway, which is mostly spared in this contraction. and given the movements up and down in minor league ball, I still find it a little hard to think specific players move the needle much here - there's no long term relationship with good players as they don't sit at a level for very long if theyre that good.

There's still going to be way more access to "professional" baseball than any other sport (by FAR).

I understand there will be an economic effect on the communities effected here. But I'm not sure I see this as a problem of access to the game, reducing interest in a notable way, etc. And hopefully the other side of this coin is improvements to the oft-criticized portions of how MiLB is run, improvement of the product overall because of the consolidation, etc.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: MiLB Contraction
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:30 pm 
User avatar
Offline
Legend of NYFS

Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:11 am
Posts: 30791
Location: NYC
That’s a lotta words that completely misses the point. Most people going to minor league baseball games do so because it’s the only professional baseball they have access to. It’s a form of family entertainment and thus it turns into being an entry point to the game for kids. As we know, in some cases that turns into a lifetime connection. It’s hard to say that will remain the same once you pull the ML affiliation away. So to me, it’s a small investment for a multi billion dollar business that helps grow the game. Contracting the minor leagues is only going to accelerate the game’s decline in popularity.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot], MarkJohnson>You, sluger11787 and 182 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group


FIND AN AA MEETING | SUICIDE DEPRESSION ADDICTION HELP | BOOK REVIEWS EDITORIAL BEST SELLERS | LOCAL DOCTORS HOSPITAL EMERGENCY CARE | LOCAL LIVE MUSIC OPEN MIC JAM | FIND YOUR CONGRESSMAN AND WHERE TO VOTE | WOMEN VETERANS HELP SUPPORT | PET FRIENDLY PARKS HOTELS | SOLAR WIND RENEWABLE POWER | FILE TAX RETURN ATTORNEY | 4G SEO SMART PHONES TABLET WEB | BIRTHDAY PARTY RENTAL CHARACTERS | HOMES APARTMENTS FOR SALE OR RENT | SPORT COURT GYM FITNESS CLUB TRACK FIELD | GET HEALTH LIFE AUTO HOME INSURANCE QUOTE | VETERAN TIPS ON CRAFT DIY RECIPES | FIND ATM BRANCH CONSOLIDATION STUDENT CREDIT LOAN RATES | LOCAL NEWS AND RSS FEEDS | CHRISTMAS BLACK FRIDAY BACK TO SCHOOL SALE | LATEST E NEWS ON MOVIES TV GAMES GIFTS BOOKS | LAST MINUTE ANNIVERSARY BIRTHDAY HOUSE WARMING GIFTS | LOCAL ARTS CRAFTS SUPPLY STORE | LOCAL LINKS TO RESTAURANTS AIRPORTS DRUG STORES | DRUG OXY OPIATE ALCOHOL PHYSICAL REHAB LOCAL NEW OR USED BOOK STORE | KNICKS BLOG FORUM BOARDS | © Untraditional Media